Tuesday, October 28, 2008

 

Sohum sign and ad wars

It actually hasn't gone too badly for signs this time around. A few Redway signs have graffiti. I've had to replace a couple of signs. I've given up on a sign location up Alderpoint Road which was placed on a friend's property. For some reason the signs just keep disappearing. Must be what is referred to on Star Trek as a "quantum event phenomenon."

But Dennis Huber reports that his 4 by 8 Clif sign in Briceland was torn down this morning, with considerable effort as it had been supported by wooden beams. The sign is back up. However, the perpetrators succeeded in rendering the sign inoperable for hours, losing exposure opportunity for untold numbers of voters. Maybe it made the difference.

Still, it hasn't reached the levels of last spring when people removed Clif and Estelle signs up and down Briceland Road and elsewhere. And it's nowhere near the Prop 8 sign wars to our north.

....

Off forum an Estelle supporter asked me to "put up or shut up" about people on Estelle's endorsement list who are no longer supporting her. Look, one such individual doesn't want to make a production, and I don't know if the others want to be public about it either. I did point out in a post last spring that George Munroe was on both Estelle's list and Clif's. Well, he has a letter in the local papers today in support of Clif.

It's not a huge deal. There may very well be people on Clif's list who have changed their minds. Unless the individuals inform the campaign, there's no way to know short of calling everybody on the list. Maybe that would be a good idea, but not every campaign raises 150 grand in a month and has legions of volunteers crossing state lines to pitch for him/her. I would assume that Johanna, who was not a candidate in June technically speaking, probably started fresh. Anyway, it happens when you have two stages of an election. But I simply mentioned the fact that I recognized two (and I've since been informed of a couple more) names of individuals who are now supporting Clif.

....

Some of you watching the world series might have noted Clif's advertisements. Apparently a national advertiser cancelled and Clif's campaign was able to bag the spots for a bargain price. And he gets free spots for games exceeding four. The Phillies are ahead, so Clif's supporters now have incentive to root for the underdog Devil Rays.

....

Those of you who picked up the local papers today know that all three campaigns invested in large ads taking up good portions of the pages. Honestly, I think Estelle's black and white piece looks the best of the three. But don't trust my tastes as a barometer of anything. For me Firefly was not only the best written science fiction series in television history, but probably in the top five series of any genre. But it couldn't get the ratings to make it through half a season.

....

Addendum: For the cute anecdote file = recently Clif was walking neighborhoods and he came to a home where a child answered. The kid's eyes widened and he yelled to his mother, "Mom, Pick Clif is here!"

....

Second addendum: Lots and lots and lots of letters to the Redwood Times yesterday about Estelle, Clif, and even a couple for Johanna. Also hospital board letters, and Prop 8 opposition letters including this one brilliantly crafted by a local blogger.

Comments:
I agree about Firefly.
 
I had a chance to walk in the Fortuna area on Monday canvassing for Estelle.

Many people of course were not home, but a relatively high percentage of people who were home had already mailed their vote, or were for sure voting for Estelle. I would guess 20% to 30%.

What is important is that Estelle doesn't have to win in Fortuna. Only 20% of Fortuna will make her the clear front runner for the district.

But the best part is that Estelles TV ads are now prime time ch. 3 & 6. This is being reflected to us when we first introduce ourselves at the door, and it is always positive. Another of Estelle's canvassing teams in Rio Dell reported similar experiences.

As far as changing their minds, it is clear that Clif's pro's hit the ground running, and very early. "Estelle can't win in Fortuna", and locking them with an early mail-in ballot was 'Clif's' main strategy, and the way it was deliberately orchestrated as a campaign tool, and chanted hypnotically by his supporters, including Eric, was negative campaign strategy from day one.

What was also obvious when walking Fortuna: people are having a chance to meet Estelle and realize that she is indeed a unique and highly qualified person who is the perfect match for this job.

Reading Eric's spin, and the trite whiners on this blog had me becoming anxious for Estelle over the last couple of weeks.

After canvassing on Monday, I'll sleep better now knowing the winds of Democracy are favoring Estelle on November 4!.
 
Yeah, I didn't know anything about it until someone lent me the discs about a year ago. It really was complex, unfortunately too complex. I thought the movie was good, but clearly dumbed down in a futile attempt to broaden the audience. I'm told that another one is in the works, but my favorite characters were killed off in the last one!
 
Oops, that last post was for Kym.
 
9:11 - Estelle also walked the precincts of Fortuna in Spring and thought she had their support then as well. I'm not saying for certain she doesn't have it now, but why would it be any different?

Either way, our phone banking and precinct walking tells us a different story. People do sometimes tell you (and us) what you want to here so they can get you off the phone/porch.

We'll know who's right by this time in a week.
 
As for the charge of "negative campaigning," all I can say is that you've led a sheltered political life if you think anything about Clif's campaign is negative. Negative is attacks on Clif's religion or assumptions that he's lying about his position on Eel River water because his brother owns a vineyard. The only comparable negativity are the tired old attacks on Estelle about reggae, and that isn't coming from anyone in Clif's campaign.
 
Both Clif and Obama horning in on America's pastime. I sense a conspiracy!
 
Firefly sucks.
 
Eric V. Kirk said...Negative is attacks on Clif's religion or assumptions that he's lying about his position on Eel River water because his brother owns a vineyard.

This does bring up an interesting point Eric. Early on, (and maybe even now) Clif on his website says he intends to restore ALL of the Eel's flows.

Clif obviously has a close family and working relationship with his brother. Like you say, his brother does have a vineyard. He also has a 4.5 million dollar per year Clendenen Vineyard Management Llc that is growing rapidly. He was also the former president of the Sonoma Winegrape Growers. These people depend on Eel River water, and they are clear that they intend to get more.

Clif also gets some or most of the apples he juices from Sonoma Vineyard orchards.

Clif says he wants to take all of the Eel River water away from the vineyards in Sonoma County. One may very understandibly think that Clif is lying once they find out this information, but the only person who has said this is you.

Eric, because someone provides information that makes your candidate look like a shit that you would rather have unknown does not make it negative campaigning. I agree with others that this appears to be at the least a conflict of interest.
 
"Clif also gets some or most of the apples he juices from Sonoma Vineyard orchards."

I was surprised when I found out. Eric's been sayin Clif is real careful what he sprays on his apples and now I find out some farmer down south might be sprayin some outdated rotgut poison on the apples and Clif wouldn't even know it. Wonder if he even cares.
 
Yes. All this speculation about Clif's motives and family is fair game. But to discuss whether Estelle's campaign might deliver the seat to Rodoni, that's "negative."

That's beyond a double standard.
 
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
 
Let me add. If Estelle ever again attempts to gain office in the county. I will be there proof in hand to make it as difficult as possible to add what I believe is yet another corruptable influence to the county government.
 
Sorry, but those are serious allegations to be made anonymously without elaboration or factual support.
 
to 10:21am
I'm not really an Estelle supporter, but if you have proof in hand to make it as difficult as possible to add what I believe is yet another corruptable influence to the county government, then where is it? Why not show it now? You may be the most honest and sincere person in the world, but this sort of smoke and mirrors is deplorable.
 
Actually, counselor, there's very little in the way of "allegations" in 10:21's post. Lots of innuendo, which is reprehensible, but let's trash the commenter for his(gender implication intended) actual behavior.
 
I believe Eric was referring to the comments in 10:19. Same poster though.
 
too bad Estelle is tainted through her affiliation with People's productions. otherwise she is a qualified candidate but because of this she will NEVER get my vote.
 
Mine, either.
 
How much did the lobbyist association at Toph's house kick in?

How much has she spent on wardrobe?
 
Some of the proof has already been made public in the Reggae War trial. But no one seems to be interested in getting the facts. I have no interest in splitting that whole drama open again.

So be it. You get the government you deserve.
 
vote clif--he has delicious apples. i had one for lunch today from redway shop smart!!!!!!!!
 
vote for anybody but a democrat or a republican. they are both horrible. democrats are a non entity. they have no strength, no sense of purpose,they have no spine to let repubs steal another election, and they are totally silent, again, about faulty voting machines.and there just aren't enough words in the "bad language" category to say about the repubs. voting for a democrat because they are slightly better than the repubs is not what our founding fathers had in mind as their idea of america. in the two party system there is one party in control, and the OPPOSITION not help the american public. the democrats fell really short in being an opposition party. the democrats resemble a dog rolling over and peeing on itself. vote anything but repub or dem. we really do need a change.(this should really piss everybody off) remember that mike thompson voted FOR the patriot act, and after telling us he would never vote for the bailout, he voted for it. he's all quack and no waddle.
 
The supervisor position is nonpartisan. Party affiliation is irrelevant.
 
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
 
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
 
vote clif--he has delicious apples. i had one for lunch today from redway shop smart!!!!!!!!


This person will obviously put anything in their body...even if it is poison.

Clendenen doesn't even have LOCAL apples. He gets them shipped up from sonoma county and then labels them LOCAL. what a fraud. There is nothing real or sustainable about clendenn
 
Estelle supporters sound so desperate.
They probably have been hanging around to many republicans.
 
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
 
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
 
Estelle supporters sound so desperate.
They probably have been hanging around to many republicans.


That's the problem w/ you people. You all only go an inch deep but a mile wide.

Estelle has some mighty fine republicans working on her campaign. and she also has some mighty fine democrats and some mighty fine Independents and greens on her campaign.
This make estelle the ideal candidate and her endorsements prove that as well.

This is a non partisan seat and estelle is the candidate that will represent everybody no matter what party you belong to.

You can't say that about her opponents.
 
These personal attacks on someone who dared take a position against their candidate are vicious and counterproductive. You don't do your candidate credit.
 
theres one way to settle that question about the letter, ask the guy george did he write or not write the letter that he signed his name to
and ask clif people do they write letters and talk people into signing them
 
I'll allow those posts if you sign your name to them or provide some sources for your information. It's cowardly to make those attacks against a private person from the cloak of anonymity.
 
Well Eric I would normally agree with you but not in this case. In southern humboldt you can have your lights put out, your family harassed, and your livlihood destroyed if you say the wrong thing in public. I don't doubt your integrity in what you are trying to do here but in reality I think you are just providing a cloak of protection so that there never will be any accountability from the so hum candidate on any real serious issues. No one seems to want to ask the hard questions when a public forum is around. Probably for the same reason above. Kind of a vicious circle ain't it.
 
In southern humboldt you can have your lights put out, your family harassed, and your livlihood destroyed if you say the wrong thing in public.

The irony is that the posts were precisely an example. A masked lynching with no trial. If you think somebody did something wrong, confront the person personally and get the whole story before pillorying somebody anonymously in a public forum. It's not really about integrity, it's about decency.
 
A wiser blogger than me once said of why we blog: "It's safer than howling at the moon because you can't hit me with a shoe."
 
What makes you think that hasn't been done already. Decency is a two way street. You have to give to get.
 
theres one way to settle that question about the letter, ask the guy george did he write or not write the letter that he signed his name to
and ask clif people do they write letters and and sign other peoples names to them



So erik, you take posts off when it does not benefit your candidate .

This is completely fair game and a legitimate question. You are the one that brought up george's letter.


did clendenen write and submit a letter to the editor and sign someone elses' name to that letter?

Richard salzman got into legal trouble for this and it was made into a big deal in the papers.
 
Put your name to the post and I'll allow them. If you're making allegations against a private person, at least have that decency. George is not a public figure and he does not blog, so he can't even defend himself.

Better yet, talk to him. If you feel he's not being up front with his answers, then come back and tell us that. But face him so that at least he knows where the claims are coming from.

You haven't even provided the basis for the allegation. You've just made the accusation and at this point it's just a rumor.

Start over. Come back with some basis for three issues:

1. That he did not write the letter.

2. That the letter does not represent his views.

3. That Clif's campaign wrote the letter and asked him to submit it.

Right now, all I have to go on is an anonymous comment on a blog.

At least during the Reggae war, people would post sources, and the basis for their allegations. I have nothing here.
 
And by the way, I've censored far more about Estelle than I have for Clif. But this isn't about Clif. Clif can respond to crap, if he wants to bother. This is profoundly unfair to George.

And if it's simply George signing a letter somebody else drafted but didn't want to be public, who cares? As long as the letter represents his views, there's nothing dishonest about it - although if the campaign is going around and asking people to sign letters they prepare, that's kind of cheesy. But you've cited no evidence of that. The campaign certainly didn't write my letter.

Still, I'm from Missouri. Show me.
 
So erik, you take posts off when it does not benefit your candidate .This is completely fair game and a legitimate question. You are the one that brought up george's letter

You have to love this kind of subtle innuendo. Do you mean to imply that he doesn't take posts off in other situations? That he is being biased? You just saw him remove several posts about Estelle, all of which I personally know to be true and some that I know he knows to be true too, yet he still removed them for whatever social or political or personal reasons of his own.

I think you might be able to critique Eric on a few things, not that it really matters, but being corrupt and biased is not one of them. In my view that is the problem with the southern humboldt culture. They kick the good back down to the curb so the ugly mean people who flock together can retain control.

In most places if this happens the other good people rise up in protest but in southern humboldt every body just seems to stay very quiet and still watching praising the heavens they haven't done anything to invoke the wrath of the ugly mean people.

That is why there is not a great diversity of people moving into southern humboldt I think. The good ones leave as soon as they get a whiff of the local scene.

Just my ten cents worth of course.
 
Cute anecdote about the kid who said, "Mom, Pick Clif is here!" I'm still chuckling.
 
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
 
This comment has been removed by the author.
 
10:00 - off topic.
 
Sorry, I just erased my post which tore into 9:26 after I read the first paragraph, which was quoting another post.

For the record, html codes, some of them, work in these posts. An i between the sideways v thingies on the front end and a /i between the thingies on the back end will italicize the passage.
 
Clif's signs are now dominating in Fortuna.
 
Clif's signs are now dominating in Fortuna.

Maybe, but I saw an Estelle sign defend itsself very well when attacked by an agressive Clif sign.
 
Yeah, I think somebody has been listening to too many of those Starkwolf ads.
 
I think Estelle's campaign was very unwise to not have checked more carefully as to who gave permission to be on her list of supporters in the paper.

I know some angry people who no longer support her and did not give permission to be named.
 
For my part, I'm really looking forward to this campaign being over.
 
The best defense is a good offense. You put somebody on your list of supporters who doesn't actually support you. They dare submit a letter to the editor which indicates that they don't actually support you. What is there to do but attack them personally?
 
I think clendenens campaign was very unwise to not have checked more carefully as to who gave permission to be on his list of supporters in the paper.

I know some angry people who no longer support him and did not give permission to be named.
 
Kinda like the Reggae Coordinator list in NCJ a couple of years back. Could Estelle have the same people working on her campaign? Whaddya think?
 
On Wednesday when you're all wondering why Johanna won, you might come back and visit this thread. If it doesn't tell you why, you'll never get it.
 
What is important is that Estelle doesn't have to win in Fortuna. Only 20% of Fortuna will make her the clear front runner for the district.

Why? This seems counter-intuitive. I would think she'd need 40% or better, since both Clif and Johanna are going to get some % of Sohum.
 
Especially since Clif has cut deep into her Sohum support.
 
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
 
Jared picked Clif.
 
If Jared picked Cliff, then you can bet on Estelle winning.
 
You are sooooo right!
She'll win THIRD PLACE AGAIN!!
 
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